It will be interesting to see what opinions are posted here. I have feelings of trepidation, because I am raw. I have one soldier who is not a conscientious objector, and I have a second one who is. As you may well imagine, there are disagreements among family. Husband/wife, siblings, granparents/grandchildren, depending upon who believes what.
Please, dear posters, I hope you will accept my plea and carefully word what you say, so that those of us who are in the midst of experiencing this may not suffer additionally. I am not asking that you change your stance or not share opinions. I mearly ask that you not pour salt and lemon juice into an already open wound.
There is an interview with Ian Slattery (associate producer of the S.O.C. film) that is worth watching (before you watch S.O.C. when it airs on PBS-POV). It takes just about a half hour to watch this YouTube clip.
I was in the Navy back in the 60′s. I was not in a war situation but was in the Mediterranean and Caribbean areas. I would have killed if I had to then but not now since I am a conscientious objector because of religious reasons. In watching the trailer of the movie, tears came to my eyes as I saw the women and children crying with their hands up and as the soldiers carried a dead person away. I could not kill a person now since I am a conscientious objector for religious reasons but, in the military, people must obey orders as the woman soldier mentioned. I have a brother in law who was in Viet Nam and he has mental problems now watching his buddies die and seeing children being killed. I know it is rough on our military personnel and hope that they all come home, safely, soon. My prayers are with them.
Someday, war will be over with. My heart is with those in the military now and hope that they can all deal with their individual situations; whether they become objectors or not. I know they are going through a great deal to protect us as United States Citizens and I am glad that we are still free.
Thanks Fred, your feelings go directly to what we wanted this film to be about – in support of soldiers whether they are objectors or not. They all have consciences!
I was a medic over there just before my retirement from the Air Force; the trailer brought back chilling memories of what I experienced. My heart goes out to the young kids doing and seeing things that they should not have to do and see.
Though I believe in the reasons we are there, it comes with a price. May God bless and protect our kids over there, and the innocents who reside there and have no voice or choice in what is happening around them. I look forward to the film coming to my local area…….
Thank you so much for making this film! My boyfriend served in the Army for 4 years and just got recalled after being out for a year. He’s currently deployed and feels completely disillusioned by the Army and opposes the war. He is very much conflicted because in no way does he support the cause. So how is he supposed to lay down his life or take the life of another when he doesn’t believe in the war? I have never been in the military so I could never personally know what these soldiers have to go through. I have however befriended many soldiers who have obvious psychological scars from being involved in war. The stories I have heard from these boys truly break my heart. I really appreciate this film because I don’t think many people realize that beneath their hardcore exteriors, soldiers still have a conscious and are often times forced into situations that violate their morals.
PBS-POV listed that in my local time zone area the film would start at midnight. I double checked with my local cable company and found that they didn’t have anything listed at all, and even said it would be off air at that time. But, I started to tape at midnight anyway, and found that I captured only the last half hour.
Can anyone tell me how I could get an ACCURATE programming schedule?
I am a 69 year old recently retired family physician who registered as a concientious objector at age 18 and was granted that status by the county draft board (no longer existent)where I was as resident.
Just finished seeing this incredibly sensitive, believably real, documentary. I thought it gave appropriate, first person focus on how war can affect the mental/spiritual dimension of the combatant soldier. And my sense is this is a deep negative wound not readily healed. Wives, families, girlfriends welcome back (if fortunate) a changed person. Unlike the courageous soldiers in the documentary who applied for c.o. status, some vets have alot of problems sorting out their post-combatant reentry into society resulting in mental illness, suicide, spouosal abuse as some of the outcomes.
Thanks, Gary Weimburg! Thanks, MyTwoSoldiers, for sharing your situation. My prayers and thoughts are with you and your extended family as well as all of our soldiers in all situations; basic training, deployed, returned.
I am a female who never served in the military…even so, your film touched me deeply. The soldiers put into words what I have always felt about war and killing. Growing up in a military family I felt alone with my beliefs. I am encouraging everyone I know to see this film.
We were honored that you allowed us to preview your film at the University of California-Berkeley Army ROTC some time ago.
I was glad to hear from Stan that the film will now be part of the curriculum at West Point. I also told him that I hope enlistees get to see this or a similar film to let them know in advance what they’re getting into. I’d rather lose recruits at the front end than have them deal with demons the rest of their lives for dilemmas faced while serving.
I very much appreciate that you took to heart one of my objections and let a small piece of film hit the cutting room floor. The final product was fair, balanced, and bore a significant emotional impact. I’m proud to recommend it to anyone.
There was one scene of a HMMWV pushing a car off the road that exploded. The objective of the film was to highlight the moral dilemma of a trained soldier questioning the justification to kill. Why did you choose to present a scene which evokes personal fear of death without a moral choice to be made? The film wasn’t about bravery vs. cowardice. I’m not saying that the awful consequences of combat aren’t a fitting story to tell, just that I can’t quite see how that is relevant to the premise of this film.
SLA Marshall’s findings of firing ratios have not been without ardent critics, but I leave that to experts in the field to discuss. More rigorous studies have produced similar results, but tying the unwillingness to fire a weapon with the unwillingness to kill requires a leap in logic. “Suppressive fire” could be an alternative explanation of why many people won’t shoot when fired upon.
Reflexive firing is a training technique to help a soldier fight, win, and survive; it is not an insidious plot to brainwash people. It’s about being quick, correct, and accurate in the decision to fire a deadly weapon. Clearly, American soldiers must be mentally conditioned to kill in the absence of a daily culture of actual killing. I think this speaks highly of our society that we MUST train people to kill, that less than 1% of our population must bear that awful burden, and our military consists entirely of volunteers.
I am very disappointed with some of the young men in this film. I’m writing from memory, so if I confuse their statements, I apologize.
Mr. Mejia seems to have placed his political beliefs ahead of his OATH of enlistment. His objection was largely to this particular war. I recall Congress authorizing the Commander-in-Chief to go to war. If Congress was “misled” or the Iraq War was unlawful, we are all eagerly awaiting the evidence in the impeachment hearing. It is not the prerogative of a soldier to question the legality, morality, or wisdom of a particular war. I invite everyone to search for and read the Oath of Enlistment and the Enlistment Contract, DD Form 4.
I respect Mr. Mejia’s and Mr. Benderman’s reluctant willingness to go to jail for what they believed, but their year-long sentences were far shorter and far less dangerous than the soldiers who served in their stead.
Mr. Casteel was trained as an interrogator to get “inside the head” of our foes. But when confronted with a committed jihadist who had been trained in counter-interrogation techniques, Mr. Casteel let our enemy get inside HIS head. It disturbs me that Mr. Casteel’s epiphany came from an adversary’s sense of “peace” in the willingness to decapitate Mr. Casteel. Mr. Casteel wasn’t expected to kill or torture this man, but merely to ask him questions which would end the war sooner and save lives.
My fellow soldiers and I were serving at UC Berkeley when Mr. Delgado gave his presentation to students there. I’m disappointed that he didn’t (literally) walk across the parking lot to invite us to hear him speak and provide our own insights and experiences. We would have brought the entire ROTC program there to listen, just like we brought them all to see the Botero paintings.
When Mr. Delgado is done talking about the isolated incidents of abuse and murder by a miniscule percentage of the millions of soldiers who served honorably in Iraq, perhaps he’ll talk about the hundreds of thousands of people who our enemies deliberately and systematically murdered. The vast majority of civilians deaths in Iraq were perpetrated by Sunni militants, Shiite militias, or Al Qaeda terrorists.
I believe it was Mr. Benderman who said words to the effect of, “I don’t want you to kill me. I don’t want to kill you,” so why are we fighting? Does anyone besides me notice what is missing from this puzzle?
Mr. Mejia suggested a similar notion: if enough people rejected war, wars wouldn’t happen. Ah, if wishes were fishes, the world would be a sea! Imagine it, and you’ll become it! Why can’t we all just get along?
He states that if people in Germany had stood up to Hitler, WWII wouldn’t have happened. From my history lessons, I recall that the economic collapse of Germany was being exploited by two violent political extremes. Many people did stand up to Hitler – they were called Communists, and they were no less violent in their approach to solving Germany’s problems.
Thank you for producing an extraordinary film and for providing a forum for discussion.
Robert M. Miller, Ph.D.
Major, US Army Reserve (Retired)
I can honestly say I have experienced this dilemma, though it was not from the Iraq war. My conflict of conscience struck me in the middle of my tour in Bosnia and to say that it was profound is underestimate the definition of profound. There I was, a young man of 20 surrounded by every manner is death and destruction and this overwhelming sense of “the moment” struck me and I was physically shaken. For weeks after question after question would enter my everyday thoughts, “Could I? Will I? Is it right? Will I still be a Christian if I did?” and it came to a point where I needed advice and requested a meeting with one of the Chaplins and to say that the meeting compounded the problem, was again profound. When I asked how do I reason my upbringing in the Church, that of “Thou shall not kill” and “For Country”, I was advised it was something that I just needed to “get over it”.
I did not have to kill in Bosnia and never pulled the trigger in my ten years of service and if I hadn’t contracted a neurological disorder that has left me disabled I was well on my way to laying down my “sword”.
I just could not come to terms with it. After seeing so much death. The children and women in the mass graves; the towns that were nothing more than fragments of walls left standing and the most profound was the people that were left: the children begging for food whose parents were both lost, the mothers that buried their whole family…..I was lost within myself reckoning the thoughts that if these people were my enemies, those that were left would have been burying my deeds and I could not let that happen.
To all soldiers, sailors, airmen and marines currently serving or having ever served you are in my thoughts. I have friends that have gone and returned and not. I have friends that I am currently counseling, to give them some sort of peace in their lives, where when they close their eyes, only the images of death and deeds exist.
I thank all those people involved in the making of this poignant and relevant look into what it is to be an American Soldier. May you and our soldiers find some peace in knowing that a new understanding is growing and with that understanding will come a new sense of responsibility to what we do and what we do not.
Benjamin J. Tatrow
Sergeant, US Army Military Police Corps (Retired)
Just wondering if anybody could post the text of the army ROTC officer when he’s talking about reactive training and something about 1 in 4 soldiers pulled the trigger in world war 2 and that number has rose significantly in conflicts since.
I caught a little of the documentary on PBS this Thursday and am trying to frame a research question based off of those statistics.
You’ll have to ask Lieutenant Colonel Kilner if he still agrees with his conclusions in this paper. He bases his findings on a book by Lieutenant Colonel David Grossman (On Killing) who based his findings on SLA Marshall.
Here are some quotes from SLA Marshall’s book, “Men Against Fire: The Problem of Battle Command in Future War.”
“In an average experienced infantry company in an average day’s action, the number engaging with any and all weapons was approximately 15 per cent of the total strength. In the most aggressive companies, under the most intense local pressure, the figure rarely rose above 25 percent of the total strength from the opening to the close of the action.”
“A revealing light is thrown upon this subject (low soldier firing rates) through studies by Medical Corps psychiatrists of the combat fatigue cases in the European Theater. They found that fear of killing, rather than fear of being killed, was the most common cause of battle failure in the individual, and that fear of failure ran a strong second.” p. 78.
Be forewarned that General Marshall’s book is not without serious criticism for the lack of rigor in his data collection methods and nonexistent statistical analysis. SLAM was an outstanding military journalist-historian, but not a disciplined researcher. LTC Grossman’s book was considered a “house of cards” primarily because he used SLAM as a reference. Both books are available online if you want them for your research.
BTW, Pete Kilner was from the US Military Academy, not ROTC.
Good luck with your research.
Robert Miller, Ph.D.
Major, US Army Reserve (Retired)
1. Presumably elimination of the draft has greatly lowered the numbers of COs.
2. All COs featured were Army combat personnel. No navy or air force. Presumably offshore shelling or aerial bombing puts enough distance from the target to insulate the attacker.
3. Critics of COs repeatedly object that “they took an oath.” With reference to the Christian perspective invoked by some COs, I note Christ’s largely ignored prohibition against oaths.
I just stumbled upon this documentary on PBS tonight and have been very moved by what I’ve seen. It gives me hope for the world to know that such thoughtful, intelligent and brave people are standing up for what they believe in every day despite difficult consequences. Thank you to the filmmakers for bringing these stories to us in such a thoughtful and intelligent way without judgement.
War is something that happens on many different battlefields and while this film is the most heroic I know of in terms of addressing the questions of conscience we all must answer if there is to be peace, I hope it is only the beginning.
I hope the questions addressed by this film lead us to a greater discussion of just how difficult a journey to conscience really is.
I am proud of my husband for the stand he took and I am proud of the work this film represents.
Going to war is not easy. I know. I have watched my husband live through two wars. One in Iraq and one within himself. The second is by far the most difficult, with the greatest risk. This may not make sense to most people — I wish more were up to the challenge. Exposing one’s heart, one’s feelings, to the world – turning against the simple acceptance of things and daring to challenge others to look within themselves in the same manner is the most difficult journey anyone can embark on. But the rewards are astronomical.
I am very grateful to some very good friends for putting as much as they have into the creation of this film. It was worth every drop of sacrifice.
I am humbled and inspired by the bravery, decency and strength of the men featured in this film. How generous of them to share their struggles.
Is there any sort of way to help?
Mike:
how to help? Great question. We made this film from that same instinct: How to help the world to be a better place. And we found many answers.
How to help the individual conscientious objectors in the film? Each of them have written books, all are available for purchase: LETTERS FROM FORT LEWIS BRIG, by Kevin Benderman, LETTERS FROM ABU GHRAIB by Joshua Casteel, THE SUTRAS OF ABU GHRAIB by Adian Delgado, ROAD FROM AR RAMADI by Camilo Mejia.
How to help the world be a more peaceful place? Certainly the answer is not to do so alone but in organizations alongside of others, are there are many to choose from. Or also, it is as simple as organizing your own showing of this film to continue the discussion about peace – among friends, neighbors, whoever is in your community.
And importantly, how to help the soldiers of all kinds who carry the burden of conscience? this is the duty, i believe, of all of us civilians, to try to warmly welcome back soldiers into society. Again, there are many organizations that bring people together to do this work, and the Army itself has many ways each of us can support the troops – a care package with a loving message of conscience and appreciation might be just the thing.
We too were humbled by the examples of these soldiers in this film, both sincere war fighters and sincere conscientious objectors, and so finally one very important way to help is simply to show respect and tolerance for those we disagree with. If we can peacefully work together to find solutions,even when we disagree – then everyone wins.
I watched the film and my emotions were roller coaster like. I’m a father, businessperson and a military veteran (Army, infantry, Viet Nam).
The military and war are deeply entrenched in this country. Much like slavery was.
The following is my story.
War is Slavery – An Awakening
It was January of 2003, late at night, and I was home alone. I turned on the TV. The movie Platoon was on. I had never watched any violent shows nor read anything about war or Viet Nam since I left there in March of 1971. Now, all these years later, I figured it was time and I could handle it. The scene was a US patrol entering a village. I saw the kids with their big dark eyes, skinny bodies and ragged clothes – and it all came back. The sights, the sounds, the smells. I turned off the TV and sat in a darkened room. It was like a lightning bolt followed by thunder. It hit me . . . and then proceeded to roll through my mind. Now what?, I asked myself.
The next day was a frenzy of activity. Answers. Answers. I needed answers. The internet (thank goodness for this powerful tool) became my life. Unstructured for the first few months, I consumed a new world of information. At 57 years of age with an MBA, it seemed like I should have known these things. But I was almost totally ignorant. Information on war, peace, politics, world affairs, religion, organizations, books, magazines, videos, DVDs, in depth radio and TV shows – and the list grew with each passing day. I needed structure. After several months I formulated two questions: Why war? and Why do we so proudly send our children to kill other children?
These two questions burned my brain. Howard Zinn helped with his book on US history. Marine Major General Smedley Butler helped with his booklet “War is a Racket”. Many other authors and people and programs moved me along the path.
My research revealed that the main causes of war are money and markets. There is always plenty of flag waving and bluster about the “evil ones”, but every war I’ve studied, once you begin peeling back the layers, has money and markets as a common core.
Why do we send our kids to kill? Because that’s how we raise them. Sometimes subtle, sometimes overt, but there is an ever present message that violence is the solution to conflict. Go into any park in any town and you’ll probably see a military statue, or a cannon. Veterans’ memorials are everywhere. Veterans and the military lead parades. The military carries the flag into sporting events. POW-MIA flags fly from Post Offices and other buildings. Highways are named after wars, war veterans, and generals. Battleships are named after Presidents. We have civil war reenactments. We call the military “service”. We let violence into our language – “I could just kill my kids”, “bullet points”, and sports announcers inject “kill”, “beat”, “destroyed” into their descriptions. The more overt influences are easy – video games, TV shows, weapon toys, paint ball parks. It’s there. Everyday. All of these lower the barriers to hurting others.
I’ve tried to summarize my findings into short, snappy slogans, to get people to think. I use to say that “war is failure”. This worked for me for a while. But war is only failure for one side. For the other side, war is magnificent. It is the best business in the world. High profits, little competition, products rapidly used. Weapons are the number one export product of the USA. Hundreds of thousands of people are employed in the death and destruction industry. Thousands also spend their lives teaching at war colleges and military schools. Other thousands plan wars and “covert actions”. Mercenary companies are on the rise. I’m told that there are over 120,000 mercenary troops in Iraq. Contractors are used for everything from “security” to spies.
Thus I needed a new slogan, a new summary of my research. I found it in an unusual location. As I walked through the Underground Railroad Museum in Cincinnati I began to feel what slavery was/is. It felt vaguely familiar. The oppression, the hatred, the total dominance, the violence, the tearing apart of families are part of slavery, but there is also “the other side”. On the other side is the money and the righteous – the people who were not only comfortable with slavery, but promoted it. The preachers, the politicians, the teachers, the business people, the pillars of society said slavery was not only necessary, it was the only way the country could survive. The slaves weren’t people. They weren’t human. It was OK to torture them and shoot them and hang them. It was OK to use dogs on them and beat them. They didn’t have a brain. The Golden Rule – the summary statement of all religions – didn’t apply to them.
Slavery will never be forgotten – on the one side. The scars are deep, bone deep, generations deep. Like war. On the other side the masters and the foreman and the slave traders and the bankers and the pillars of society and all those who supported and profited from slavery didn’t have bad memories. They didn’t have loses. They knew that what they did was “right for the country’”. There was nothing to forget.
As I thought about slavery over the next months I began to realize that slavery and war are very similar. The one side (the slaves, or in war – the civilians and the lower ranks of the military) suffers. The other side says war is a great and noble thing and the only way the country can survive. War is slavery.
Arnold Stieber – Michigan – WarisSlavery.blogspot.com
Hi Guys – I want to talk with you about an online interview with public affairs interviewer Jay Ackroyd. These are done through the phone, streamed live into Second Life and BlogTalk Radio. Please email.
I WAS RECENTLY INTRODUCED TO YOUR PAGE BY A FRIEND.I THINK IT IS AN EXCELLENT WAY FOR EX-VIETNAM VETS TO BLOW OFF STEAM RELATED TO THEIR EXPERIENCES IN NAM, EVEN AFTER A PERIOD OF OVER 40 YEARS. IT’S THE SAME OLD STUFF, WARS DON’T EVER STOP. SEEMS WE HAVE ONE, BIG OR SMALL, EVERY TEN YEARS OF SO. WHO KNOWS THE NEXT TARGET, THE OIL OF IRAN,THE THEORETICAL PROTECTION FOR OUR 51s STATE ISRAEL, THE MARKETS OF CHINA, RUSSIA, OR WITH THE HORRID COUNTRY OF NORTH KOREA WHICH HAS NOTHING BUT DENSE POVERTY AS WELL AS DENSE HEADS. A NEW WAR COULD REDIRECT OUR CURENT TENSIONS INVOLVING OUR DEPLORABLE ECONOMY. WE SHOULD BE WATCHFUL, BECAUSE IN TIMES OF ECONOMIC DOWNTURN, RECESSION, DEPRESSION, OR ANY NATIONAL CRISIS, ADMINISTRATIONS ALWAYS COMES UP WITH “WE HAD TO DO IT FOR OUR SECURITY” AND, OR, “IN THE NATIONAL INTEREST” AND THEY PLOWS RIGHT AHEAD LIKE THEY DID IN VIETNAM AND IRAQ. I SPENT TEN YEARS IN NAM AS A CIVILIAN, AND MILITARY ADVISOR, STAYING TO THE VERY END IN LATE APRIL 1975, SO I CAN UNDERSTAND THOSE WHO ARE FRUSTRATED, ABHOR WAR AND CONFLICT, TRULY FEEL. I LIVE OVERSEAS IN BATAM, INDONESIA, NOT FAR FROM SINGAPORE WHERE I AM WRITNG MY LIFE THOUGHTS ON VIETNAM AND KOREA. IT IS QUITE DISTANT FROM INTERNATIONAL CONFLICT, BUT I THINK ABOUT IT ALOT AND TAKE A SOME SMALL WAR OPPOSING ACTION FROM TIME TO TIME. BEST OF LUCK TO YOU AT THE BLOG. KEEP IT OPEN.
Sorry, I don’t buy it. If you are truly a conscientious objector, you should not have joined the military. There is no draft and you knew what you were getting into. I thank God there are soldiers, sailors and airmen who are willing to risk life and limb to protect our Nation. I did 40+ years ago, and I am proud of my service.
Many who voice disagreement with the War On Terror do so using the talking points and propaganda fed to them by the Anti-American left. If you think we live in a safe world with no enemies who wish us dead, you are not paying attention.
25 yrs plus in the military. You say peace I say what cost of freedom is lost in peace. Peace without FREEDOM is nothing. The founders of this nation recognized that cost and settled for nothing less then FREEDOM. FREEDOM must be fought for. We are losing our FREEDOMS everyday with Government becoming bigger and bigger. We as a FREE people must fight wherever FREEDOM is challenged. To die in the service of your country to protect FREEDOM is an great honor. We do not send children to fight our wars we send young men , we do not send out children with bombs ready to blow just to take out a target. Words are fine but when words do not work it is time for action. In ACTION creates more death and the loss of FREEDOM.
I see many anti Jewish statements on this blog. R. Lee being the last to put out the anti Jewish statement in the protection of the Jewish state. (Its own state not one of ours)They have a right to be an independent state. Sense the beginning they have been at war with the nations around them. It is people like R. Lee that cause many problems in that area of the world. You would think someone who was in Nam during the war would understand that. There was an interview with a North Vietnam Gen. done many years after the war where as he stated “We knew we could not defeat the forces of the U.S. but we could hold out until the will of the people to fight the war was gone and those forces taken out.” History is being repeated again . Our military is the best on earth it is not an military of conquerers but one of Peace and FREEDOM. FREEDOM won through blood .
If this war is about money something went wrong very wrong! Many on this blog say war = profits . I see no one major military supplier making tons of money but do see many laying off workers to stay above water. Lockheed may be closing it’s F-22 line down as soon as two yrs. Far short the number of A/C needed for our Air Forces Future. This is going on all over our defense industry. I would like to thank all who have served and will serve. Your service in the fight for world FREEDOM is and will always be a just cause. We are a nation of Peace and try on protect it, but words only go so far then action is needed. Hopefully we can get Iran and North Korea into side of Peace and FREEDOM. If not many will die and it will not be from the lack of trying to talk peace with them.
The best part about being human is our ability to empathize with the feelings of other people. Right or wrong, those who suffer should get our understanding and care.
Thanks for your comment, Fred! You really hit on one of the key messages of the film; with respect and compassion, we can strive to better understand the questions of conscience that face us all.
My son has sent me this link and asked me to purchase the DVD. He has just been discharged from the Army after serving 2 years, one in Iraq, as a conscientious objecter. His grandfather is a WWII Marine, one of Edson’s Raiders in the South Pacific who is 87 years old and still awakens in a sweat, or cries out at night periodically. He is not a weak man, neither is his grandson. I support my son and I support our military who make the sacrifice so the US can be free.
We need to get this site current and relevant again. Start blogging about peace. There is a significant movement of humanity sweeping the planet. We are demonstrating that our military can do more than attack and defend. We can deliver aid for natural disasters in the form of water, food, medical services and evacuations. I am a 15 year veteran who has recently requested designation as a conscientious objector. If I can do it so can anyone in the military. The time is now.
I agree – there was never a more suitable time to discuss this than now.
The environment, the financial and political systems are failing – people are joining together to protest that something has got to give.
And that something is a decision of the masses not to be part of the killing machine.
It’s never an easy decision but as somebody said in the film – once slavery was accepted.
War must also be banished as barbaric and a primitive and useless way to solve our disputes.
October 9, 2008 at 2:03 pm
It will be interesting to see what opinions are posted here. I have feelings of trepidation, because I am raw. I have one soldier who is not a conscientious objector, and I have a second one who is. As you may well imagine, there are disagreements among family. Husband/wife, siblings, granparents/grandchildren, depending upon who believes what.
Please, dear posters, I hope you will accept my plea and carefully word what you say, so that those of us who are in the midst of experiencing this may not suffer additionally. I am not asking that you change your stance or not share opinions. I mearly ask that you not pour salt and lemon juice into an already open wound.
October 9, 2008 at 2:31 pm
“Interview – Soldiers of Conscience” on YouTube
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dNmE2zqVcig&feature=related
There is an interview with Ian Slattery (associate producer of the S.O.C. film) that is worth watching (before you watch S.O.C. when it airs on PBS-POV). It takes just about a half hour to watch this YouTube clip.
October 10, 2008 at 9:27 pm
I was in the Navy back in the 60′s. I was not in a war situation but was in the Mediterranean and Caribbean areas. I would have killed if I had to then but not now since I am a conscientious objector because of religious reasons. In watching the trailer of the movie, tears came to my eyes as I saw the women and children crying with their hands up and as the soldiers carried a dead person away. I could not kill a person now since I am a conscientious objector for religious reasons but, in the military, people must obey orders as the woman soldier mentioned. I have a brother in law who was in Viet Nam and he has mental problems now watching his buddies die and seeing children being killed. I know it is rough on our military personnel and hope that they all come home, safely, soon. My prayers are with them.
Someday, war will be over with. My heart is with those in the military now and hope that they can all deal with their individual situations; whether they become objectors or not. I know they are going through a great deal to protect us as United States Citizens and I am glad that we are still free.
October 12, 2008 at 7:42 pm
Thanks Fred, your feelings go directly to what we wanted this film to be about – in support of soldiers whether they are objectors or not. They all have consciences!
October 16, 2008 at 2:30 am
I was a medic over there just before my retirement from the Air Force; the trailer brought back chilling memories of what I experienced. My heart goes out to the young kids doing and seeing things that they should not have to do and see.
Though I believe in the reasons we are there, it comes with a price. May God bless and protect our kids over there, and the innocents who reside there and have no voice or choice in what is happening around them. I look forward to the film coming to my local area…….
October 17, 2008 at 6:51 am
Thank you so much for making this film! My boyfriend served in the Army for 4 years and just got recalled after being out for a year. He’s currently deployed and feels completely disillusioned by the Army and opposes the war. He is very much conflicted because in no way does he support the cause. So how is he supposed to lay down his life or take the life of another when he doesn’t believe in the war? I have never been in the military so I could never personally know what these soldiers have to go through. I have however befriended many soldiers who have obvious psychological scars from being involved in war. The stories I have heard from these boys truly break my heart. I really appreciate this film because I don’t think many people realize that beneath their hardcore exteriors, soldiers still have a conscious and are often times forced into situations that violate their morals.
October 17, 2008 at 12:01 pm
Really frustrated here.
PBS-POV listed that in my local time zone area the film would start at midnight. I double checked with my local cable company and found that they didn’t have anything listed at all, and even said it would be off air at that time. But, I started to tape at midnight anyway, and found that I captured only the last half hour.
Can anyone tell me how I could get an ACCURATE programming schedule?
Thanks.
October 17, 2008 at 4:54 pm
I am a 69 year old recently retired family physician who registered as a concientious objector at age 18 and was granted that status by the county draft board (no longer existent)where I was as resident.
Just finished seeing this incredibly sensitive, believably real, documentary. I thought it gave appropriate, first person focus on how war can affect the mental/spiritual dimension of the combatant soldier. And my sense is this is a deep negative wound not readily healed. Wives, families, girlfriends welcome back (if fortunate) a changed person. Unlike the courageous soldiers in the documentary who applied for c.o. status, some vets have alot of problems sorting out their post-combatant reentry into society resulting in mental illness, suicide, spouosal abuse as some of the outcomes.
Thanks, Gary Weimburg! Thanks, MyTwoSoldiers, for sharing your situation. My prayers and thoughts are with you and your extended family as well as all of our soldiers in all situations; basic training, deployed, returned.
October 17, 2008 at 8:55 pm
I am a female who never served in the military…even so, your film touched me deeply. The soldiers put into words what I have always felt about war and killing. Growing up in a military family I felt alone with my beliefs. I am encouraging everyone I know to see this film.
October 17, 2008 at 11:10 pm
Hello Gary:
We were honored that you allowed us to preview your film at the University of California-Berkeley Army ROTC some time ago.
I was glad to hear from Stan that the film will now be part of the curriculum at West Point. I also told him that I hope enlistees get to see this or a similar film to let them know in advance what they’re getting into. I’d rather lose recruits at the front end than have them deal with demons the rest of their lives for dilemmas faced while serving.
I very much appreciate that you took to heart one of my objections and let a small piece of film hit the cutting room floor. The final product was fair, balanced, and bore a significant emotional impact. I’m proud to recommend it to anyone.
There was one scene of a HMMWV pushing a car off the road that exploded. The objective of the film was to highlight the moral dilemma of a trained soldier questioning the justification to kill. Why did you choose to present a scene which evokes personal fear of death without a moral choice to be made? The film wasn’t about bravery vs. cowardice. I’m not saying that the awful consequences of combat aren’t a fitting story to tell, just that I can’t quite see how that is relevant to the premise of this film.
SLA Marshall’s findings of firing ratios have not been without ardent critics, but I leave that to experts in the field to discuss. More rigorous studies have produced similar results, but tying the unwillingness to fire a weapon with the unwillingness to kill requires a leap in logic. “Suppressive fire” could be an alternative explanation of why many people won’t shoot when fired upon.
Reflexive firing is a training technique to help a soldier fight, win, and survive; it is not an insidious plot to brainwash people. It’s about being quick, correct, and accurate in the decision to fire a deadly weapon. Clearly, American soldiers must be mentally conditioned to kill in the absence of a daily culture of actual killing. I think this speaks highly of our society that we MUST train people to kill, that less than 1% of our population must bear that awful burden, and our military consists entirely of volunteers.
I am very disappointed with some of the young men in this film. I’m writing from memory, so if I confuse their statements, I apologize.
Mr. Mejia seems to have placed his political beliefs ahead of his OATH of enlistment. His objection was largely to this particular war. I recall Congress authorizing the Commander-in-Chief to go to war. If Congress was “misled” or the Iraq War was unlawful, we are all eagerly awaiting the evidence in the impeachment hearing. It is not the prerogative of a soldier to question the legality, morality, or wisdom of a particular war. I invite everyone to search for and read the Oath of Enlistment and the Enlistment Contract, DD Form 4.
I respect Mr. Mejia’s and Mr. Benderman’s reluctant willingness to go to jail for what they believed, but their year-long sentences were far shorter and far less dangerous than the soldiers who served in their stead.
Mr. Casteel was trained as an interrogator to get “inside the head” of our foes. But when confronted with a committed jihadist who had been trained in counter-interrogation techniques, Mr. Casteel let our enemy get inside HIS head. It disturbs me that Mr. Casteel’s epiphany came from an adversary’s sense of “peace” in the willingness to decapitate Mr. Casteel. Mr. Casteel wasn’t expected to kill or torture this man, but merely to ask him questions which would end the war sooner and save lives.
My fellow soldiers and I were serving at UC Berkeley when Mr. Delgado gave his presentation to students there. I’m disappointed that he didn’t (literally) walk across the parking lot to invite us to hear him speak and provide our own insights and experiences. We would have brought the entire ROTC program there to listen, just like we brought them all to see the Botero paintings.
When Mr. Delgado is done talking about the isolated incidents of abuse and murder by a miniscule percentage of the millions of soldiers who served honorably in Iraq, perhaps he’ll talk about the hundreds of thousands of people who our enemies deliberately and systematically murdered. The vast majority of civilians deaths in Iraq were perpetrated by Sunni militants, Shiite militias, or Al Qaeda terrorists.
I believe it was Mr. Benderman who said words to the effect of, “I don’t want you to kill me. I don’t want to kill you,” so why are we fighting? Does anyone besides me notice what is missing from this puzzle?
Mr. Mejia suggested a similar notion: if enough people rejected war, wars wouldn’t happen. Ah, if wishes were fishes, the world would be a sea! Imagine it, and you’ll become it! Why can’t we all just get along?
He states that if people in Germany had stood up to Hitler, WWII wouldn’t have happened. From my history lessons, I recall that the economic collapse of Germany was being exploited by two violent political extremes. Many people did stand up to Hitler – they were called Communists, and they were no less violent in their approach to solving Germany’s problems.
Thank you for producing an extraordinary film and for providing a forum for discussion.
Robert M. Miller, Ph.D.
Major, US Army Reserve (Retired)
October 18, 2008 at 5:13 am
I can honestly say I have experienced this dilemma, though it was not from the Iraq war. My conflict of conscience struck me in the middle of my tour in Bosnia and to say that it was profound is underestimate the definition of profound. There I was, a young man of 20 surrounded by every manner is death and destruction and this overwhelming sense of “the moment” struck me and I was physically shaken. For weeks after question after question would enter my everyday thoughts, “Could I? Will I? Is it right? Will I still be a Christian if I did?” and it came to a point where I needed advice and requested a meeting with one of the Chaplins and to say that the meeting compounded the problem, was again profound. When I asked how do I reason my upbringing in the Church, that of “Thou shall not kill” and “For Country”, I was advised it was something that I just needed to “get over it”.
I did not have to kill in Bosnia and never pulled the trigger in my ten years of service and if I hadn’t contracted a neurological disorder that has left me disabled I was well on my way to laying down my “sword”.
I just could not come to terms with it. After seeing so much death. The children and women in the mass graves; the towns that were nothing more than fragments of walls left standing and the most profound was the people that were left: the children begging for food whose parents were both lost, the mothers that buried their whole family…..I was lost within myself reckoning the thoughts that if these people were my enemies, those that were left would have been burying my deeds and I could not let that happen.
To all soldiers, sailors, airmen and marines currently serving or having ever served you are in my thoughts. I have friends that have gone and returned and not. I have friends that I am currently counseling, to give them some sort of peace in their lives, where when they close their eyes, only the images of death and deeds exist.
I thank all those people involved in the making of this poignant and relevant look into what it is to be an American Soldier. May you and our soldiers find some peace in knowing that a new understanding is growing and with that understanding will come a new sense of responsibility to what we do and what we do not.
Benjamin J. Tatrow
Sergeant, US Army Military Police Corps (Retired)
October 18, 2008 at 2:51 pm
Just wondering if anybody could post the text of the army ROTC officer when he’s talking about reactive training and something about 1 in 4 soldiers pulled the trigger in world war 2 and that number has rose significantly in conflicts since.
I caught a little of the documentary on PBS this Thursday and am trying to frame a research question based off of those statistics.
Thanks so much.
October 19, 2008 at 5:03 am
Nate:
Here is an article from Pete Kilner (way back when he was a Captain) that will give you exactly the statistics you are seeking:
http://www.au.af.mil/au/awc/awcgate/jscope/kilner00.htm
You’ll have to ask Lieutenant Colonel Kilner if he still agrees with his conclusions in this paper. He bases his findings on a book by Lieutenant Colonel David Grossman (On Killing) who based his findings on SLA Marshall.
Here are some quotes from SLA Marshall’s book, “Men Against Fire: The Problem of Battle Command in Future War.”
“In an average experienced infantry company in an average day’s action, the number engaging with any and all weapons was approximately 15 per cent of the total strength. In the most aggressive companies, under the most intense local pressure, the figure rarely rose above 25 percent of the total strength from the opening to the close of the action.”
“A revealing light is thrown upon this subject (low soldier firing rates) through studies by Medical Corps psychiatrists of the combat fatigue cases in the European Theater. They found that fear of killing, rather than fear of being killed, was the most common cause of battle failure in the individual, and that fear of failure ran a strong second.” p. 78.
Be forewarned that General Marshall’s book is not without serious criticism for the lack of rigor in his data collection methods and nonexistent statistical analysis. SLAM was an outstanding military journalist-historian, but not a disciplined researcher. LTC Grossman’s book was considered a “house of cards” primarily because he used SLAM as a reference. Both books are available online if you want them for your research.
BTW, Pete Kilner was from the US Military Academy, not ROTC.
Good luck with your research.
Robert Miller, Ph.D.
Major, US Army Reserve (Retired)
October 19, 2008 at 5:09 am
Nate:
Here is a link to LTC Kilner’s blog. If you have questions for him, you’ll find an e-mail link under his profile:
http://soldier-ethicist.blogspot.com/2005/07/military-leaders-obligation-to-justify.html
October 19, 2008 at 10:42 pm
1. Presumably elimination of the draft has greatly lowered the numbers of COs.
2. All COs featured were Army combat personnel. No navy or air force. Presumably offshore shelling or aerial bombing puts enough distance from the target to insulate the attacker.
3. Critics of COs repeatedly object that “they took an oath.” With reference to the Christian perspective invoked by some COs, I note Christ’s largely ignored prohibition against oaths.
October 19, 2008 at 10:57 pm
<<>> Thank you, John K.
October 20, 2008 at 4:28 am
I just stumbled upon this documentary on PBS tonight and have been very moved by what I’ve seen. It gives me hope for the world to know that such thoughtful, intelligent and brave people are standing up for what they believe in every day despite difficult consequences. Thank you to the filmmakers for bringing these stories to us in such a thoughtful and intelligent way without judgement.
November 13, 2008 at 5:26 am
War is something that happens on many different battlefields and while this film is the most heroic I know of in terms of addressing the questions of conscience we all must answer if there is to be peace, I hope it is only the beginning.
I hope the questions addressed by this film lead us to a greater discussion of just how difficult a journey to conscience really is.
I am proud of my husband for the stand he took and I am proud of the work this film represents.
Going to war is not easy. I know. I have watched my husband live through two wars. One in Iraq and one within himself. The second is by far the most difficult, with the greatest risk. This may not make sense to most people — I wish more were up to the challenge. Exposing one’s heart, one’s feelings, to the world – turning against the simple acceptance of things and daring to challenge others to look within themselves in the same manner is the most difficult journey anyone can embark on. But the rewards are astronomical.
I am very grateful to some very good friends for putting as much as they have into the creation of this film. It was worth every drop of sacrifice.
Thanks Gary and Cathy — Love Monica
November 17, 2008 at 3:16 am
I am humbled and inspired by the bravery, decency and strength of the men featured in this film. How generous of them to share their struggles.
Is there any sort of way to help?
November 19, 2008 at 5:06 am
Mike:
how to help? Great question. We made this film from that same instinct: How to help the world to be a better place. And we found many answers.
How to help the individual conscientious objectors in the film? Each of them have written books, all are available for purchase: LETTERS FROM FORT LEWIS BRIG, by Kevin Benderman, LETTERS FROM ABU GHRAIB by Joshua Casteel, THE SUTRAS OF ABU GHRAIB by Adian Delgado, ROAD FROM AR RAMADI by Camilo Mejia.
How to help the world be a more peaceful place? Certainly the answer is not to do so alone but in organizations alongside of others, are there are many to choose from. Or also, it is as simple as organizing your own showing of this film to continue the discussion about peace – among friends, neighbors, whoever is in your community.
And importantly, how to help the soldiers of all kinds who carry the burden of conscience? this is the duty, i believe, of all of us civilians, to try to warmly welcome back soldiers into society. Again, there are many organizations that bring people together to do this work, and the Army itself has many ways each of us can support the troops – a care package with a loving message of conscience and appreciation might be just the thing.
We too were humbled by the examples of these soldiers in this film, both sincere war fighters and sincere conscientious objectors, and so finally one very important way to help is simply to show respect and tolerance for those we disagree with. If we can peacefully work together to find solutions,even when we disagree – then everyone wins.
December 4, 2008 at 12:53 pm
I watched the film and my emotions were roller coaster like. I’m a father, businessperson and a military veteran (Army, infantry, Viet Nam).
The military and war are deeply entrenched in this country. Much like slavery was.
The following is my story.
War is Slavery – An Awakening
It was January of 2003, late at night, and I was home alone. I turned on the TV. The movie Platoon was on. I had never watched any violent shows nor read anything about war or Viet Nam since I left there in March of 1971. Now, all these years later, I figured it was time and I could handle it. The scene was a US patrol entering a village. I saw the kids with their big dark eyes, skinny bodies and ragged clothes – and it all came back. The sights, the sounds, the smells. I turned off the TV and sat in a darkened room. It was like a lightning bolt followed by thunder. It hit me . . . and then proceeded to roll through my mind. Now what?, I asked myself.
The next day was a frenzy of activity. Answers. Answers. I needed answers. The internet (thank goodness for this powerful tool) became my life. Unstructured for the first few months, I consumed a new world of information. At 57 years of age with an MBA, it seemed like I should have known these things. But I was almost totally ignorant. Information on war, peace, politics, world affairs, religion, organizations, books, magazines, videos, DVDs, in depth radio and TV shows – and the list grew with each passing day. I needed structure. After several months I formulated two questions: Why war? and Why do we so proudly send our children to kill other children?
These two questions burned my brain. Howard Zinn helped with his book on US history. Marine Major General Smedley Butler helped with his booklet “War is a Racket”. Many other authors and people and programs moved me along the path.
My research revealed that the main causes of war are money and markets. There is always plenty of flag waving and bluster about the “evil ones”, but every war I’ve studied, once you begin peeling back the layers, has money and markets as a common core.
Why do we send our kids to kill? Because that’s how we raise them. Sometimes subtle, sometimes overt, but there is an ever present message that violence is the solution to conflict. Go into any park in any town and you’ll probably see a military statue, or a cannon. Veterans’ memorials are everywhere. Veterans and the military lead parades. The military carries the flag into sporting events. POW-MIA flags fly from Post Offices and other buildings. Highways are named after wars, war veterans, and generals. Battleships are named after Presidents. We have civil war reenactments. We call the military “service”. We let violence into our language – “I could just kill my kids”, “bullet points”, and sports announcers inject “kill”, “beat”, “destroyed” into their descriptions. The more overt influences are easy – video games, TV shows, weapon toys, paint ball parks. It’s there. Everyday. All of these lower the barriers to hurting others.
I’ve tried to summarize my findings into short, snappy slogans, to get people to think. I use to say that “war is failure”. This worked for me for a while. But war is only failure for one side. For the other side, war is magnificent. It is the best business in the world. High profits, little competition, products rapidly used. Weapons are the number one export product of the USA. Hundreds of thousands of people are employed in the death and destruction industry. Thousands also spend their lives teaching at war colleges and military schools. Other thousands plan wars and “covert actions”. Mercenary companies are on the rise. I’m told that there are over 120,000 mercenary troops in Iraq. Contractors are used for everything from “security” to spies.
Thus I needed a new slogan, a new summary of my research. I found it in an unusual location. As I walked through the Underground Railroad Museum in Cincinnati I began to feel what slavery was/is. It felt vaguely familiar. The oppression, the hatred, the total dominance, the violence, the tearing apart of families are part of slavery, but there is also “the other side”. On the other side is the money and the righteous – the people who were not only comfortable with slavery, but promoted it. The preachers, the politicians, the teachers, the business people, the pillars of society said slavery was not only necessary, it was the only way the country could survive. The slaves weren’t people. They weren’t human. It was OK to torture them and shoot them and hang them. It was OK to use dogs on them and beat them. They didn’t have a brain. The Golden Rule – the summary statement of all religions – didn’t apply to them.
Slavery will never be forgotten – on the one side. The scars are deep, bone deep, generations deep. Like war. On the other side the masters and the foreman and the slave traders and the bankers and the pillars of society and all those who supported and profited from slavery didn’t have bad memories. They didn’t have loses. They knew that what they did was “right for the country’”. There was nothing to forget.
As I thought about slavery over the next months I began to realize that slavery and war are very similar. The one side (the slaves, or in war – the civilians and the lower ranks of the military) suffers. The other side says war is a great and noble thing and the only way the country can survive. War is slavery.
Arnold Stieber – Michigan – WarisSlavery.blogspot.com
December 13, 2008 at 9:00 pm
Hi Guys – I want to talk with you about an online interview with public affairs interviewer Jay Ackroyd. These are done through the phone, streamed live into Second Life and BlogTalk Radio. Please email.
March 18, 2009 at 11:48 am
TO THE GOOD PEOPLE AT WARISSLAVERY.COM.
I WAS RECENTLY INTRODUCED TO YOUR PAGE BY A FRIEND.I THINK IT IS AN EXCELLENT WAY FOR EX-VIETNAM VETS TO BLOW OFF STEAM RELATED TO THEIR EXPERIENCES IN NAM, EVEN AFTER A PERIOD OF OVER 40 YEARS. IT’S THE SAME OLD STUFF, WARS DON’T EVER STOP. SEEMS WE HAVE ONE, BIG OR SMALL, EVERY TEN YEARS OF SO. WHO KNOWS THE NEXT TARGET, THE OIL OF IRAN,THE THEORETICAL PROTECTION FOR OUR 51s STATE ISRAEL, THE MARKETS OF CHINA, RUSSIA, OR WITH THE HORRID COUNTRY OF NORTH KOREA WHICH HAS NOTHING BUT DENSE POVERTY AS WELL AS DENSE HEADS. A NEW WAR COULD REDIRECT OUR CURENT TENSIONS INVOLVING OUR DEPLORABLE ECONOMY. WE SHOULD BE WATCHFUL, BECAUSE IN TIMES OF ECONOMIC DOWNTURN, RECESSION, DEPRESSION, OR ANY NATIONAL CRISIS, ADMINISTRATIONS ALWAYS COMES UP WITH “WE HAD TO DO IT FOR OUR SECURITY” AND, OR, “IN THE NATIONAL INTEREST” AND THEY PLOWS RIGHT AHEAD LIKE THEY DID IN VIETNAM AND IRAQ. I SPENT TEN YEARS IN NAM AS A CIVILIAN, AND MILITARY ADVISOR, STAYING TO THE VERY END IN LATE APRIL 1975, SO I CAN UNDERSTAND THOSE WHO ARE FRUSTRATED, ABHOR WAR AND CONFLICT, TRULY FEEL. I LIVE OVERSEAS IN BATAM, INDONESIA, NOT FAR FROM SINGAPORE WHERE I AM WRITNG MY LIFE THOUGHTS ON VIETNAM AND KOREA. IT IS QUITE DISTANT FROM INTERNATIONAL CONFLICT, BUT I THINK ABOUT IT ALOT AND TAKE A SOME SMALL WAR OPPOSING ACTION FROM TIME TO TIME. BEST OF LUCK TO YOU AT THE BLOG. KEEP IT OPEN.
April 7, 2009 at 5:18 pm
Sorry, I don’t buy it. If you are truly a conscientious objector, you should not have joined the military. There is no draft and you knew what you were getting into. I thank God there are soldiers, sailors and airmen who are willing to risk life and limb to protect our Nation. I did 40+ years ago, and I am proud of my service.
Many who voice disagreement with the War On Terror do so using the talking points and propaganda fed to them by the Anti-American left. If you think we live in a safe world with no enemies who wish us dead, you are not paying attention.
May 30, 2009 at 11:09 pm
25 yrs plus in the military. You say peace I say what cost of freedom is lost in peace. Peace without FREEDOM is nothing. The founders of this nation recognized that cost and settled for nothing less then FREEDOM. FREEDOM must be fought for. We are losing our FREEDOMS everyday with Government becoming bigger and bigger. We as a FREE people must fight wherever FREEDOM is challenged. To die in the service of your country to protect FREEDOM is an great honor. We do not send children to fight our wars we send young men , we do not send out children with bombs ready to blow just to take out a target. Words are fine but when words do not work it is time for action. In ACTION creates more death and the loss of FREEDOM.
PEACE – FREEDOM= ZERO
May 30, 2009 at 11:26 pm
I see many anti Jewish statements on this blog. R. Lee being the last to put out the anti Jewish statement in the protection of the Jewish state. (Its own state not one of ours)They have a right to be an independent state. Sense the beginning they have been at war with the nations around them. It is people like R. Lee that cause many problems in that area of the world. You would think someone who was in Nam during the war would understand that. There was an interview with a North Vietnam Gen. done many years after the war where as he stated “We knew we could not defeat the forces of the U.S. but we could hold out until the will of the people to fight the war was gone and those forces taken out.” History is being repeated again . Our military is the best on earth it is not an military of conquerers but one of Peace and FREEDOM. FREEDOM won through blood .
May 30, 2009 at 11:35 pm
If this war is about money something went wrong very wrong! Many on this blog say war = profits . I see no one major military supplier making tons of money but do see many laying off workers to stay above water. Lockheed may be closing it’s F-22 line down as soon as two yrs. Far short the number of A/C needed for our Air Forces Future. This is going on all over our defense industry. I would like to thank all who have served and will serve. Your service in the fight for world FREEDOM is and will always be a just cause. We are a nation of Peace and try on protect it, but words only go so far then action is needed. Hopefully we can get Iran and North Korea into side of Peace and FREEDOM. If not many will die and it will not be from the lack of trying to talk peace with them.
October 9, 2009 at 4:49 pm
The best part about being human is our ability to empathize with the feelings of other people. Right or wrong, those who suffer should get our understanding and care.
October 12, 2009 at 9:48 pm
Thanks for your comment, Fred! You really hit on one of the key messages of the film; with respect and compassion, we can strive to better understand the questions of conscience that face us all.
December 29, 2009 at 5:55 pm
Watching the film is very powerful and it should be, when humans are killing each other. the book Every war has two losers is so true.
January 4, 2010 at 2:55 am
My son has sent me this link and asked me to purchase the DVD. He has just been discharged from the Army after serving 2 years, one in Iraq, as a conscientious objecter. His grandfather is a WWII Marine, one of Edson’s Raiders in the South Pacific who is 87 years old and still awakens in a sweat, or cries out at night periodically. He is not a weak man, neither is his grandson. I support my son and I support our military who make the sacrifice so the US can be free.
March 27, 2011 at 5:49 pm
We need to get this site current and relevant again. Start blogging about peace. There is a significant movement of humanity sweeping the planet. We are demonstrating that our military can do more than attack and defend. We can deliver aid for natural disasters in the form of water, food, medical services and evacuations. I am a 15 year veteran who has recently requested designation as a conscientious objector. If I can do it so can anyone in the military. The time is now.
December 4, 2011 at 3:34 pm
I agree – there was never a more suitable time to discuss this than now.
The environment, the financial and political systems are failing – people are joining together to protest that something has got to give.
And that something is a decision of the masses not to be part of the killing machine.
It’s never an easy decision but as somebody said in the film – once slavery was accepted.
War must also be banished as barbaric and a primitive and useless way to solve our disputes.